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2.5 Definitions Location

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jvecchi View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote jvecchi Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: Jul/24/2016 at 11:37pm
Because most states do not include private property crashes within their state crash repositories, there did not seem to be a great deal of interest in separating out the parking lot from the (generally) outside loop that encircles most lots but is still private property.  However, for those who do include private property crashes, there is probably benefit to better describing and differentiating the aisles between rows of parked vehicles and the perimeter thru-way.  Comments?
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote mmcdonald Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: Aug/02/2016 at 10:05pm
Not commenting on the existence or non-existence of the defined locations of each, but both of these were discussed at the MMUCC-5 Expert Panel meeting and may result in a recommendation to combine Driveway Access and Driveway Access Related into the same attribute.  I believe the same recommendation was true for Entrance/Exit Ramp and Entrance/Exit Ramp Related.  Just an FYI.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote mmcdonald Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: Aug/02/2016 at 10:08pm
I think there is some merit to this for we have an example on the perimeter thru-way at our local mall which does not constitute part of the mall's private property at this location in our State.
Michael McDonald
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote mmcdonald Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: Aug/02/2016 at 10:12pm
I actually agree with these definitions of "intersection" probably because this is the precise definition we were taught in the police academy even as far back as 1978.  It may not seem to be by some, but it is simple and easy to understand; especially for cops!  Smile
Michael McDonald
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote jdolan Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: Aug/19/2016 at 3:48pm
Originally posted by sweissman sweissman wrote:

Originally posted by sweissman sweissman wrote:

"Figure 4 - Driver Access (See 2.5.9)" would benefit from some updates:
  • The areas for driveway access are marked, but what constitutes driveway access-related are not;
  • The lines denoting the shoulder on the north and sidewalk on the south of the roadway are the same, even though they are meant to depict very different roadway attributes; and
  • The shoulder/sidewalk lines that cross the driveways should be dashed to denote a non-physical boundary.

Additionally, I propose we add the term Driveway Access-related to the list of location definitions.

"Driveway Access-related" is addressed in definition 2.7.4.1.


Edited by jdolan - Aug/19/2016 at 3:54pm
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote jdolan Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: Aug/19/2016 at 4:36pm
Originally posted by mmcdonald mmcdonald wrote:

I actually agree with these definitions of "intersection" probably because this is the precise definition we were taught in the police academy even as far back as 1978.  It may not seem to be by some, but it is simple and easy to understand; especially for cops!  Smile

The current ANSI definition and the MUTCD definition are not too much different. The two primary differences seem to be:

  1. The treatment of signalized junctions. Under MUTCD, signalized driveway access would be an intersection, while this is specifically excluded from the ANSI definition. 
  2. Also, under certain conditions, two junctions that are more than 10 meters apart could be regarded as one intersection. ANSI does not address these situations.
I am torn on this one. As a data scientist, I prefer specificity over generality. However, I suspect a more complex definition than the current one probably won't do much to enhance our understanding of intersection crashes. It would conflict with the MMUCC standard, and for the cops who pay attention to the change, increase the complexity of the crash investigation. I think I've talked myself into keeping the current definition, perhaps with the addition of signalized driveway accesses, many of which I'll bet are already being reported as intersections.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote jdolan Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: Aug/19/2016 at 4:44pm
Originally posted by mmcdonald mmcdonald wrote:

I think there is some merit to this for we have an example on the perimeter thru-way at our local mall which does not constitute part of the mall's private property at this location in our State.

I agree. I have had discussions with our FARS analysts regarding crashes on these kinds of roadways, and under their interpretation of the FARS rules, many of them count as traffic fatalities.
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